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Post by tefla on Sept 22, 2015 2:05:00 GMT -5
Anyone else wondering about the telemarketer call? Yep....no way a telemarketer is going to ask for Captain Beckett....surprised Castle let that pass. Wonder if he will recall it in the course of trying to find out what happened. Actually ... I have a tendency to watch Castle live with closed captioning on (it is a habit) If the "telemarketer guy" who called was Vikram, I read the captioning as Katherine Beckett? It was Castle who answered the phone as "Captain Beckett's phone" |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2015 5:12:35 GMT -5
It had to be about a secret meet "Okay, understood" could be that he said come alone and not to tell anyone. Castle was the one who answered the phone Captain Beckett phone. To me the man corrected himself when he said may I speak to Captain Beckett.
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Post by glo1196 on Sept 22, 2015 10:40:12 GMT -5
Omission is a lie, especially when you know it goes against the person's wishes. Castle lied when he said nothing when she told him that if he looks into her mother's death they were over. He did it again when he kept her away from her mother's case. He had alterior motives for keeping her away (Smith) but he lied in that he kept the truth from her. He lied by keeping about the existence of Smith from her and steering her away. Again though each omission and lie was to protect her. Just as hers are to protect him.
They are both guilty of keeping things from each other, to protect the other. If you want to hang Beckett for it that's fine, but this entire show has been about two people who have been dedicated to each other, and in love with each other but at first to afraid to admit it and mess it up. Now they are together and they have proven time and time again that they will do anything to protect the one they love. Beckett has risked her life and career for him over and over, even when he was treating her like crap when he was with Slaughter.
They have both risked their lives for the other. So yes, she lied, and yes, he's lied. Of course we would never be in their positions, but which one of us wouldn't lie to protect the ones we love? Because it isn't love if you wouldn't try everything to save the one you love.Oh, and we don't know the second part yet, so maybe he would be in even more danger if he knew what was going on.
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Post by castlelover66 on Sept 22, 2015 10:54:33 GMT -5
I get that Castle and Beckett have lied to each other, but I thought it might be different once they were married. My personal opinion is that lying is wrong, no matter what, period. I can't say what I would do in a life and death situation, but I would find it hard to lie, even to protect the ones I love.
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Post by ProudTVJunkie on Sept 22, 2015 10:55:06 GMT -5
What bothered me was that this was the first big lie since they've been married, and for me, that makes it different and more serious. When they said, "partners in crime and in life" in those vows, I took it to mean they were in this together no matter what. That's why Beckett lying seems more hurtful now.
That said, we haven't heard her side of this story yet so I'll try and keep an open mind until then.
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Post by glo1196 on Sept 22, 2015 11:04:25 GMT -5
Maybe you guys are right, but I can't help thinking that if my loved one was in danger and I could do anything to save them or keep them safe I would. Because to me their life and their safety would mean more. Heck lying would probably be one of the least dangerous things I would do. The best thing is that Kate and Castle aren't real and in the end we can debate and laugh over it all because it's TV. I still think they are hands down the best couple on TV!
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Post by shutterbug5269 on Sept 23, 2015 7:51:46 GMT -5
Maybe you guys are right, but I can't help thinking that if my loved one was in danger and I could do anything to save them or keep them safe I would. Because to me their life and their safety would mean more. Heck lying would probably be one of the least dangerous things I would do. The best thing is that Kate and Castle aren't real and in the end we can debate and laugh over it all because it's TV. I still think they are hands down the best couple on TV! Except that this lie put the people she loves in more danger, not less. Castle was the first person the bad guys went after when it was clearthey couldn't find her. A circumstance she neither foresaw accounted for or even thought of when she first set off on this Odyssey. Something she should have considered from the start. Did she really think she could keep him out of it indefinitely once she went off grid? |
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Post by ProudTVJunkie on Sept 23, 2015 9:43:28 GMT -5
Maybe you guys are right, but I can't help thinking that if my loved one was in danger and I could do anything to save them or keep them safe I would. Because to me their life and their safety would mean more. Heck lying would probably be one of the least dangerous things I would do. The best thing is that Kate and Castle aren't real and in the end we can debate and laugh over it all because it's TV. I still think they are hands down the best couple on TV! Except that this lie put the people she loves in more danger, not less. Castle was the first person the bad guys went after when it was clearthey couldn't find her. A circumstance she neither foresaw accounted for or even thought of when she first set off on this Odyssey. Something she should have considered from the start. Did she really think she could keep him out of it indefinitely once she went off grid? I was thinking the same thing. If it's that serious that they are sending armed assassin teams after her, then of course they're going to go after her family to get to her and doesn't Rick deserve a heads up at the very least? But I'm trying to set that aside and wait for the rest of the story on Monday. |
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Post by shutterbug5269 on Sept 23, 2015 10:08:39 GMT -5
To hear the show runners tell it, Bracken seems to have the spot on asessment of Beckett.
This was less about Castle and more about her compulsion talking. She's acting like an addict.
It wasn't until Castle was almost killed that she saw the truth of it I think.
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Post by java on Sept 23, 2015 10:25:33 GMT -5
While Kate's lies did rub me the wrong way, I think there are two factors we should keep in mind.
First, just because a person gets married doesn't mean you always see a fundamental change in their behavior. Some do and some don't. Even as far as the season 5 Xmas episode, Kate was still telling lies albeit white lies to avoid confrontation (volunteering for the Xmas shift for those who may have forgotten). These behaviors that drives a spouse insane will have to be worked on through the course of a marriage and some may never quite overcome it.
Second, Kate is now captain and that means operational and management headaches. I can see her easily reverting back to lies and withholding information to manage her professional and personal life. It's just too difficult at this early stage not to use the old skillsets that have served her in the past for better or worse. Whether it's telling lies to protect her need to know the story husband or to deflect private and privileged information, honesty isn't always the best policy. That's something you tell children so they'll learn right from wrong until they're old enough to understand that you sometimes have to lie to protect yourself or to not hurt those you love. Do these jeans make me fat? Nope. How do you like my new haircut? Love it. Yes, go to sleep because Santa is coming. You get the idea.
And you do remember how an overzealous Castle almost got himself killed in DC?
Oh, final thought. Now that she's captain, she must separate and distance herself a bit from Esposito and Ryan because now she's responsible for their annual evaluations, pay raise recommendations, etc. Yep, the headaches of management.
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Post by ProudTVJunkie on Sept 23, 2015 14:05:02 GMT -5
While Kate's lies did rub me the wrong way, I think there are two factors we should keep in mind. First, just because a person gets married doesn't mean you always see a fundamental change in their behavior. Some do and some don't. Even as far as the season 5 Xmas episode, Kate was still telling lies albeit white lies to avoid confrontation (volunteering for the Xmas shift for those who may have forgotten). These behaviors that drives a spouse insane will have to be worked on through the course of a marriage and some may never quite overcome it. Second, Kate is now captain and that means operational and management headaches. I can see her easily reverting back to lies and withholding information to manage her professional and personal life. It's just too difficult at this early stage not to use the old skillsets that have served her in the past for better or worse. Whether it's telling lies to protect her need to know the story husband or to deflect private and privileged information, honesty isn't always the best policy. That's something you tell children so they'll learn right from wrong until they're old enough to understand that you sometimes have to lie to protect yourself or to not hurt those you love. Do these jeans make me fat? Nope. How do you like my new haircut? Love it. Yes, go to sleep because Santa is coming. You get the idea. And you do remember how an overzealous Castle almost got himself killed in DC? Oh, final thought. Now that she's captain, she must separate and distance herself a bit from Esposito and Ryan because now she's responsible for their annual evaluations, pay raise recommendations, etc. Yep, the headaches of management. All of the reasons you mention are completely valid and why I'm not really thrilled that they moved Beckett up to Captain...but I'm trying to keep an open mind. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2015 14:44:49 GMT -5
While Kate's lies did rub me the wrong way, I think there are two factors we should keep in mind. First, just because a person gets married doesn't mean you always see a fundamental change in their behavior. Some do and some don't. Even as far as the season 5 Xmas episode, Kate was still telling lies albeit white lies to avoid confrontation (volunteering for the Xmas shift for those who may have forgotten). These behaviors that drives a spouse insane will have to be worked on through the course of a marriage and some may never quite overcome it. Second, Kate is now captain and that means operational and management headaches. I can see her easily reverting back to lies and withholding information to manage her professional and personal life. It's just too difficult at this early stage not to use the old skillsets that have served her in the past for better or worse. Whether it's telling lies to protect her need to know the story husband or to deflect private and privileged information, honesty isn't always the best policy. That's something you tell children so they'll learn right from wrong until they're old enough to understand that you sometimes have to lie to protect yourself or to not hurt those you love. Do these jeans make me fat? Nope. How do you like my new haircut? Love it. Yes, go to sleep because Santa is coming. You get the idea. And you do remember how an overzealous Castle almost got himself killed in DC? Oh, final thought. Now that she's captain, she must separate and distance herself a bit from Esposito and Ryan because now she's responsible for their annual evaluations, pay raise recommendations, etc. Yep, the headaches of management. All of the reasons you mention are completely valid and why I'm not really thrilled that they moved Beckett up to Captain...but I'm trying to keep an open mind. Just another perspective... My husband's job is very stressful. I am completely guilty of little white lies and lies of omission. Why? Because there are things that I take care of on a daily basis that can be worked out without what they were factoring in to his life at all. Burdening him with every little thing would put him over the edge. His plate is full 99% of the time, because even on his days off, he's either doing photography shoots for friends/their kids/family (he's cheap for those he cares about and he is professional-grade), and oftentimes, because he half runs the place of business where he works, he's getting constant phone calls. Yes, many executive decisions SHOULD be made without him on his days off, but that doesn't always happen. At any rate, because I love him, I try to save him from aggravation that will not add any value or significance to his existence. Same goes for my mom. She's a perfectionist and very idealistic. When she asks about something in our life, and it's not something I think she would like to hear, I will skirt around it. Is that for my benefit? Probably. Because I"m almost 49 years old, and she still feels the need to "mother" me in ways I don't always find helpful. Such as I omit telling her how much weight I've lost, as 20 pounds ago she already thought me too skinny and proceeded to lecture me on the subject. Do I need that in my life? Sometimes. Oftentimes not. I'm totally guilty of the little lies to try to make others feel better about themselves, such as Java outlined about clothing or decorating choices. Some things my mom finds fun to add to her decor, I would not in a million years. But because she thinks it's cool, I will oftentimes share her excitement. There are times when I am outright with her and tell her, "That's ugly as sin", but only when I feel very strongly about it. LoL! If my husband asks me if he needs a hair cut, but I know he's had a wicked week and would do better sleeping in on Saturday morning instead of waking up and running to the barber, I tell him it can wait. Where there is wicked need for the truth, I am a straight arrow. As far as Kate and her job... even to Castle, yes, if I felt his safety was in question and I needed to protect him, I would lie. Until it was safe to come clean. There are times you just can't share everything. Physician/patient, lawyer/client privileges, keeping a confidence. And yes, I will lie by omission to keep a confidence. Some things are just not my story to tell. There is a big difference between the NEED to withhold truth of provide false information temporarily, vs. pathological lying, denial, or stirring the pot, which oftentimes come out as gossip and rumors. And something I have had the misfortune of being a victim of, is gossip in the form of a prayer request at church. Anyway, I would rather have someone furious with me and alive, than the alternative. Grace, forgiveness, kindness, patience, and tasting our words before they leave our tongue is always a good idea. I'm talking to myself here, too. Intention and motive in this area should always be understood. If my opinion and how I do life in this arena makes me a crappy friend, family member, whatever, so be it. Truth & Lies according to CastleKat. FWIW. |
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Post by ProudTVJunkie on Sept 23, 2015 14:52:34 GMT -5
I completely understand about lies in a relationship. I used to run an animal shelter. My husband and I both love animals but in that type of a job, tragedies occur regularly. Animals die whether from illness, abuse or euthanasia. I realized early on that when my husband (then boyfriend) asked me about my day that I couldn't tell him every detail and sometimes had to skirt the truth entirely because it was too heartbreaking. The fact was, I signed up for a difficult job. He didn't.
But that kind of reality isn't necessarily fun to watch play out on screen and I watch Castle because it is fun!
That said, we have no idea where this particular storyline is heading so I'm willing to wait to see what the writers have in mind...but as a whole, I don't enjoy watching Castle and Beckett lie to one another, even if it is justified.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2015 15:01:25 GMT -5
I completely understand about lies in a relationship. I used to run an animal shelter. My husband and I both love animals but in that type of a job, tragedies occur regularly. Animals die whether from illness, abuse or euthanasia. I realized early on that when my husband (then boyfriend) asked me about my day that I couldn't tell him every detail and sometimes had to skirt the truth entirely because it was too heartbreaking. The fact was, I signed up for a difficult job. He didn't. But that kind of reality isn't necessarily fun to watch play out on screen and I watch Castle because it is fun! That said, we have no idea where this particular storyline is heading so I'm willing to wait to see what the writers have in mind...but as a whole, I don't enjoy watching Castle and Beckett lie to one another, even if it is justified. I love how our interpretations and feelings are so varied. But deep down, I don't think any of us are really that different when it comes to this topic. If you would tell me you never said a little white lie, or wouldn't lie to protect someone you love, in the right circumstance, I don't know that I would believe you. Old habits die hard, and Beckett is who she is. If Castle, or any of us, thinks that Kate would tell Castle every little thing, "partners in love and in life", regarding her job, we are deceived. Just my opinion. And because it is TV, perhaps I am finding it refreshing that life and love is messy (love that) and that someone such as Kate is being depicted accurately. It's who she is. But that doesn't mean she isn't trying/going to change. The beauty is we can be angry, frustrated, and question why, until all the pieces fall into place and understanding is achieved. If we're lucky enough to get to that point. Anyway, love this banter, guys!  |
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Post by CF40 on Sept 23, 2015 16:42:27 GMT -5
As far as Kate and her job... even to Castle, yes, if I felt his safety was in question and I needed to protect him, I would lie. Until it was safe to come clean. There are times you just can't share everything. Physician/patient, lawyer/client privileges, keeping a confidence. And yes, I will lie by omission to keep a confidence. Some things are just not my story to tell. If my opinion and how I do life in this arena makes me a crappy friend, family member, whatever, so be it. Truth & Lies according to CastleKat. FWIW. Fair enough and I completely understand the need for some things to be withheld due to the nature of Beckett's new job. That's why I am so hoping that "XX" will provide the plausible explanation I need for the lie. I just didn't want to get hit over the head again already with the appearance of mistrust, deceit, lying (however one wants to think of it) between Caskett. Crappy friend?? nah. never.  |
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